There’s a Tiger Behind That Smile: How Cathy Bond Became an Accidental Advocate

In this episode we sit down with Cathy Bond, the founder of See Beyond Where You Are LLC, a professional advocacy agency aimed at helping underserved minority communities navigate the healthcare system for better outcomes. With over 30 years of personal advocacy experience, Cathy shares her accidental journey into patient advocacy, stemming from a traumatic health scare her mother faced when she was 18. The catalyst for her advocacy work was her determination to challenge bias and improve healthcare quality for her family and others.

Cathy Bond's advocacy extends beyond her agency, as she actively participates in initiatives like the Pulse Center for Patient Safety and Education and Advocacy. She discusses her role in developing the Take Charge campaign and serving on the ACEs Advocates Collaborative Educational Series, emphasizing her commitment to patient safety education and advocacy.

During the interview, Cathy sheds light on her natural inclination to advocate for others, emphasizing the importance of knowing and asserting one's rights in healthcare settings. She also discusses her See Beyond podcast, which serves as a motivational platform encouraging listeners to embrace personal growth. Cathy's faith-based approach to advocacy and podcasting reflects her commitment to love and support, aiming to uplift individuals facing various life challenges.

Cathy Bond's patient advocacy services primarily focus on geriatric clients, specializing in cancer-related cases. She provides hands-on assistance, from hospital visits to telehealth consultations, ensuring her clients are heard, protected, and cared for. The podcast explores Cathy's personal experiences, including an unexpected injury during a family vacation that highlighted the need for self-advocacy in unfamiliar healthcare settings.

Transcript

Host

With more than 30 years of personal advocacy experience with family and friends, Kathy founded a professional advocacy agency, See Beyond Where You Are LLC to formalize her commitment to helping underserved minority communities in her suburban Atlanta community, navigate the healthcare system effectively and ensure better health outcomes. As a natural educator, Kathy embraced her role as a board certified patient advocate with empathy, understanding, and a fearless determination to confront and address bias and difference in poor quality within the healthcare delivery system for our clients. To promote her wellness philosophy, Kathy founded the See Beyond podcast to inspire listeners to embrace and support their personal journey and growth. Concerned with the devastating harm caused by medical errors and misdiagnosis, Kathy joined Pulse Center for Patient Safety and Education and Advocacy, and help develop the Take Charge campaign and serves on the ACEs Advocates Collaborative Educational Series, Leadership Team, two national Pulse Center programs promoting patient safety education and advocacy. We're really excited to have her here. Cathy Bond, thank you so much for being here. How are you? Cathy Bond, MD,

Cathy Bond

I am doing well, John, and thank you for having me. Thank you, Greater National, and especially a thanks to Brad.

Host

Thank you.

We love Brad Schwartz. He's a great figure. I want to kind of dive in and find out, you know, you've been doing advocacy in some respect for 30 years. How did it start?

Cathy Bond

Absolutely.

Cathy Bond

So I got started, actually I say this, I am an accidental, on purpose, patient advocate. I got started accidentally. And I think being vulnerable is what made me be a patient advocate. At the age of about 18 or so, my mom had a health scare and it was very traumatic for her. But also for me, this is where I learned how to speak up for her.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

And in turn for myself and for others, I had a doctor that was wanting to perform surgery, but I didn't understand why. And they couldn't give me a reason that satisfied me or it could explain to me why she needed the surgery. They threw me out of the hospital room because I wouldn't consent. And just heartbroken and crying, I went to a desk and said,

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

I need to speak to someone in charge. That was the only thing that I could think to say. And the lady at the information booth took mercy on me and called risk management. They came down and spoke with me and I explained the situation. I was crying. I was distraught, but I had enough knowledge or love for my mother to want to make sure that she got the best healthcare. And from there...

It was off and running, but it was by accident that I became a patient advocate.

Host

And what made you feel compelled to do this for others? Obviously we all feel the call when it's our own family, right? Some of us are a little bit less squeamish or have a little bit more of that. Let's do it attitude like you did, which is amazing, but what made you realize, you know what? I need to do this for other people.

Cathy Bond

I think it's the, and I don't think I've said this out loud, but I think it's the tiger in me, it's the fight in me. I cannot stand seeing anyone being mistreated. I absolutely detest it. It annihilates people, it annihilates communities, societies. So anywhere I can find...

Host

Mm.

Cathy Bond

to, I can seek to stand up for someone, I will. So what made me take this even beyond my family and friends is one day I was at the hospital with my mother and this lady needed help and she was being treated in a way that was beneath to be treated humanly. And I went over and I said to her, can I help you?

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

And I told her my name and again, this is before I'm a board certified patient advocate. And she was just trying to get help. And I said, let me help you. And I began to explain what she wanted and relate to her what they said, what they explained it to her actually. And from there, just the things that she gave me and the hug and just doing it whenever I seen someone needing my help, that made me become a patient advocate. And as you said in my bio,

Host

Yep.

Cathy Bond

I'm a natural born teacher. I want to teach. I want to instruct. I want to make sure that if I know it, someone else can know it.

Host

What do you find that you teach the most to your clients? What's the gap in knowledge that you wish more people knew?

Cathy Bond

Knowing their rights, when you know your rights and you know how to convey those rights, how to speak to them, how to communicate about it, you feel more empowered. And a no can quickly become a yes, or I can't becomes I can. Or even if it can't, you go away with the feeling that you stood up for yourself and you knew what you could ask for, whether we get it or not.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

we know what to ask for. So I teach people their rights. I teach them how to stand up and advocate for those rights in just simple language and without being hostile or upset, but just simply knowing because it is empowering. But what's more empowering is knowing how to do it.

Host

Thank you.

Host

I think that's such an important message. The idea that it's not just about knowing your rights, but also how to deliver the knowledge and kind of let people know that you know your rights so that it's not antagonistic. I mean, at the end of the day, if you're dealing with healthcare professionals, the last thing you want is for them to think that you're an enemy of some sort, that you're, you just want to listen, look, I know, I understand that I have this right. And there's a kindness and there's a way to articulate it that's effective so that you don't kind of

you know, have any animosity in the air.

Cathy Bond

Absolutely. We've all encountered, well I don't want to say all, but there are times I've encountered personally a nurse or a doctor, as I explained to you earlier, that was less than hospitable, that was truly unkind. And now that I've been doing this for a while, I know how to smile and just say what I need to say, but me never heard of it. I think I have a nice smile, I try to be kind to everyone, but...

As I said earlier, there's a tiger in me. And the tiger can smile, but I will bite at the same time. But it's in a good manner in that I'm going to get what I need for myself, for my mother, for the person that I'm helping, whether it's for free or just if I'm being paid, it doesn't matter. We all deserve great healthcare. And if I'm around, you're going to get it.

Host

And what do you feel is a good example? Can you give me an example of a patient, right, that you feel some patients don't know they have, that you typically have to educate them on? Yes.

Cathy Bond

Absolutely. My next door neighbor is Vietnamese. Her husband had an accident at work. He sliced his hand really badly. And she called me while they're on the way to the hospital and asked if I could come because they don't speak a lot of English, some, but not a lot. And so as I'm on my way, they're sitting in the waiting area, he's bleeding and no one is helping them. So when I

Host

Good night.

Host

See you.

Cathy Bond

I asked if they signed in, she said yes. And I asked if they spoke to anyone, and she said no, there was no one to help them. And I said, what do you mean there's no one to help you? Well, no one understood what they were talking about. She didn't understand that she had the right to get an interpreter. So I go up with them and I say what we want, and they say, oh, well, you can translate for them. And I said, no, I cannot. I do not speak Vietnamese. So we're going to get a Vietnamese interpreter.

Host

Yes.

Host

Thank you.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

When it's going to take a couple of hours, I said, no, as you can see, he's bleeding. He doesn't have a couple of hours. You have 15 minutes to get someone on the phone. And we would appreciate it. I stand right here and I moved to the side so you can get someone else, but I will stand right here so that you won't forget us. And within 10 minutes, we had an interpreter on the phone.

Host

I think that's about it. We'll see.

Host

Thanks.

Host

That's amazing. And just doing it politely and understanding that you can't block the line. I mean, those little touches really make a huge difference. Why do you feel that, uh, people in the healthcare system don't uphold those patient rights more often?

Cathy Bond

I think it's easy to not see people as human sometimes. When we see people on a daily basis, they're used to the cuss, they're used to the bruises, they're used to the emergencies. We're not. So it's easy to sometimes forget, not even on purpose, but to just push a person aside, especially when they have a situation where they are economically disadvantaged.

Host

It's easy.

Host

Mm-hmm.

Cathy Bond

can't speak the language very well. Sometimes being a skin color that people may not think is appropriate or particular that they like, it's easy to dehumanize people. So I think just that smile is disarming, you know, but the words are knowledgeable and those two things combined makes you, oh, wait a minute, let me get this right. Let me, oh, I'm sorry. And I've gotten that plenty of times. Oh, I'm sorry.

simply because I make that person human. I make that person seen and not being visible or devalued.

Host

and

Host

Yeah, absolutely. You touched on prejudice, you know, people seeing others is not human. And, and I've read in your bio that, you know, you focus on minority cultures. Where do you see that happen? And how do you think we can kind of grow as a society to try and move in a better direction in that front? On that front?

Cathy Bond

Well, there are several things I think we can do. But one of the things that I feel, if we start just in this one place, it can change our perception. If we actually take these two words off of the healthcare forms, black and white, that's a start. Because I say this all the time, I'm not a black woman. I'm a brown woman. My hair is black, but my skin is brown. Your shirt is white. Your skin is not.

Host

I know.

Host

Thank you.

Host

Thanks.

Host

Yeah.

Cathy Bond

If we take those two words off of the forms, that's a beginning because those words or African-American have stigmas to them. I'm an American. It doesn't mean I'm an African-American. I'm just an American. If we start just there, the visualization of those words and our history, it connects those two things. But we change that. It's connect that visualization. Yes, the history is there, but it allows us

Host

Right.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

us to start off in a fresh way and go beyond that. That's one thing. The second thing I think would be just we talk about sensitivity training and diversity training. Yes, who's teaching these classes? Are you including people that look like me? Are you including Asians and Hispanics and Vietnamese? Are you including Jamaicans? Are you including Africans?

Host

Thank you.

Host

Yes.

Host

Thank you.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

Because we're the ones that can tell you how we feel about a situation and can help make better decisions in the healthcare. And I think also nurses having a little bit more voice and the things that they can help out with patients as well and not being rushed as well.

Host

Great ideas. I love the idea of making sure that the inclusivity of the instructors is equally, if not more important than the idea of the training itself to have an informed voice there. When it comes to your role as an advocate and what kind of services you offer and what kind of help you actually give, it sounds like you're in the hospital setting with some clients.

What do you view your role? Cause advocacy is kind of a weird umbrella term these days. Some people focus on billing. Some people are retired nurses and they really just are clinical advisors. You sound like you get your hands dirty in terms of kind of navigating the system. What does it look like to work with you?

Cathy Bond

Well, as you said, I'm not a clinician, I'm not a retired nurse, anything like that, and I don't do billing. To work with me is to just simply walk you in the hospital and show you and teach you or raise your expectations of what you're going to get. Right? I can help you with communicating with the doctor.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

I can help you with understanding the diagnosis. I can even help with making sure that your medications will not have side effects or if you take several medications. Getting going to the pharmacy, having these, having a medication list done, make sure everything is well with that. Having you know what the next steps will be if you're diagnosed with a disease and you don't understand. In addition to that, I am at the hospital. I'm sitting there right with you. I will go to the appointments with you. I will even do a telehealth visit with you.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

I would be on the phone with you. If you have family members that live out of town, I'm a good person that will relay what's going on to your family members if you give me the say so or the permission to do so. Even if you're in the hospital, and I know this is kind of a situation for women where you have to get a mammogram, having a male person that does that is very uncomfortable.

So I can be somewhere close by with you to give you that assurance. So if you work with me, the one thing that you will get is assurance, assurance that you'll be heard, protected, and cared for.

Host

I love that. That sounds that sounds like peace of mind to me, right? The assurance that you're going to be cared for is more than a lot. I think we've all had that, that instance, myself included, where you're you check into the ER or urgent care. Four hours go by and you don't even know if they, if they know you still exist. And it's very frustrating. A lot of people just don't know how to handle a situation.

Cathy Bond

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

It is frustrating.

Host

Tell me about, tell me about your podcast, uh, and, and what your goal was in creating the podcast.

Cathy Bond

I think I begin to think about that question and I think my podcasting goals and my advocacy goals actually combined. They are separate, but they are combined. In my podcasting journey, I'm simply helping people to see beyond where they are. Whether it's a health care situation, loss of a loved one, financial situation, or just life. I'm making sure that I encourage people.

Host

Amen.

Host

Thank you.

Host

making sure that.

Cathy Bond

motivate, inspire them to see beyond that situation. One day doesn't, one day can change your life. And if you can see that, you can get to that life that you want. So whether I'm being a patient advocate or not on my podcast, I'm just a motivator. I'm a faith-based motivator. And because I use biblical terminology, biblical verses to inspire you, to help, to motivate.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

and encourage. So my podcast is just about encouraging.

Host

Do you feel like faith and your kind of relationship with that part of your life, um, informs the way you approach things? And is that why you've chose to kind of go down that journey in your podcast?

Cathy Bond

Absolutely. For me, my faith walk has been the defining factor, even in me being a patient advocate, because one of the things that my faith teaches me is love. So when I say about Asians and Americans and brown skin and white skin, it's my love. And in my podcast, I want people to hear that. If you use my service as a patient advocate, you get to see it.

Host

Thank you.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

but the listeners don't see me, so they get to hear it. So my faith journey is definitely important to me because I want people to feel that love.

Host

And I've noticed on your podcast, you don't really talk about patient advocacy. What's the decision there?

Cathy Bond

Because even if it's just life, I'm advocating for you to advocate for your a better life. I'm advocating that you see beyond where you are without telling you that I'm advocating for it. As you said earlier, podcasting is a huge umbrella. And although I do not call it being a patient advocate, my podcast is just simply, it's a patient advocacy, but it's just with a twist. And that twist is just, as I said earlier.

Host

Thank you.

Host

same.

Host

Goodbye.

Cathy Bond

being faith-based in love.

Host

Beautiful. I got a note from one of our onboarding assistants before you kind of came on the podcast to ask you about the most dangerous and unforeseen adventure you had while on vacation. And I purposely didn't ask you before. I kind of wanted to keep the surprise for myself, but if you wouldn't mind sharing, I'd love to hear the story.

Cathy Bond

Sure. My daughter was well, my daughter was in the 12th grade. She was getting ready to graduate and she made straight A's. So for that particular time I said to her, we're going to go take a journey, a trip. We went on a cruise and it was a seven day cruise, beautiful.

Host

Bye.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

but I got hurt on the cruise. So I had on some little sandals and we was going down to this little dune in the British Virgin Islands and I slipped and twisted my ankle so bad. I didn't know it was hurt that bad. So I like, I was just sitting there and just wait till everybody leave. And they had to pick me up and carry me back to the ship. People had their hands on me in places that I didn't want them to have their hands on me.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

I got ready to get on the boat to get back to the ship, the little ferry boat to get back to the bigger cruise boat. They wouldn't let me on because I didn't pay for that one. People forced me on. The guy was upset, threatened to call the police on me. But I get back to the ship and I'm injured really badly. They want to leave me in the British Virgin Islands so I can go to the doctor, but I refuse to go. And even in that.

Host

Thank you.

Host

in this.

Cathy Bond

I was not a patient advocate then, wasn't even thinking about it. But I realized that there had a defining moment in my life as well because then and there in a different country, I had to advocate for my own health, make sure I get the health care that I needed without being left. So I was pretty scared. My husband didn't know about, you know, we had health insurance, but he didn't understand what was going to happen to my daughters in high school. It was rough. It was...

Host

Thank you.

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

Yeah, and I was in pain.

Host

did you get the attention you needed? Did you just get it on the ship?

Cathy Bond

I absolutely did. They would not leave him in a country that I...

Host

I mean, was there enough medical professionals to address it?

Cathy Bond

Absolutely. So what happened with the reason they wanted to leave me was because the x-ray machine was broken And they wanted to make sure that my foot or ankle wasn't broken So I sent to them the next port that we went to

Host

Thank you.

Cathy Bond

I would go and get my foot checked because I knew I would have enough time. So what I did was I called my family back in the United States, had them to call the Bahamas, Nassau Bahamas Hospital, and let them know what day I was coming so that I could have an appointment to go get my foot x-rayed so that I would not miss that the crew was coming back. So when the ship docked, I went to the hospital, had my foot x-rayed, I was fine, and I went back.

May it beckon a shoe.

Host

for you. Hope they gave you some painkillers just to kind of enjoy the rest of the cruise. You know. Okay, all right. Well, that were you were you crutches on a cruise sound a little complicated, but luckily they probably they have elevators. So it's not so bad. Where are you? Where are you based out of? And where do you actually work with people in person? And then what kind of services can you offer virtual?

Cathy Bond

Thanks.

Oh, they absolutely feed it. They absolutely, and crutches.

Cathy Bond

Yeah.

Cathy Bond

So I'm based in Stone Mountain, Georgia. So it's right outside of Atlanta, in between Gwinnett County. So Gwinnett County is a huge county, Atlanta is huge. And then I live in the Camp County. So I'm in between three major counties. So that's really considered the metropolitan area. With the services that I offer are for families, but mostly for older clients. I love helping geriatric clients because again,

Host

Nice.

Cathy Bond

that's where we can be dehumanized and not as cared for as we should. So that's my specialty. Cancer, different types of cancers.

Cathy Bond

I'm on, I'm so sorry. I'm on Zoom.

Host

That's okay, I can cut this out. Do you need to answer the door or something?

Cathy Bond

No, that's fine. I have guests in my house as well. So that's another thing. But the services that I offer are yes, you can contact me and I can do tele services. And what I will do is just talk you through your hospital visit, go over your, what you need. I can help you file an appeal if you need to. Just recently, I helped someone file an appeal that was in a nursing home. They wanted to release her. I got that appeal overturned.

Host

That's okay. I put a mark on it. I'll cut it out. Don't worry about it.

Cathy Bond

I will go to the hospital with you. I will teach you your rights by showing you where you can find those privacy rights in the hospital, patient rights in the hospital where they are posted. I teach you how to ask for risk management if need be. So whatever you need, pretty much I'm able to do it. If I cannot, that's the beauty of being a patient advocate. There are others that are more savvy and more knowledgeable in certain areas than I am, and I can connect with those people.

Host

Thank you.

Host

I always love hearing that. I mean, I think the advocacy space is so collaborative and knowing where your expertise ends instead of saying, oh, we'll figure it out. It's like, no, there's another person that I can call. We've already connected. I've worked with them on other cases. And that spirit of collaboration and connection I really feel should be spread more in the medical field in general. So I'm glad to see it so alive and well in the advocacy space.

Cathy Bond

Well, I think because we want to make sure that we impact the health care setting, it starts with us. So eventually it will carry over into the health care setting. I really believe that.

Host

Where, uh, so your podcast, see beyond where you are, I assume people can check that out on the Apple store, the iTunes store and Spotify and all those places. Is that right? And if people want to work with you directly as an advocate, what's the easiest way for them to get in touch with you?

Cathy Bond

Anyway, anywhere you can find a podcast, my podcast is there.

Cathy Bond

They can email me directly at cbond, B-O-N-D, at cbeyondwhereuare.com, spelled out.

Host

See Bond at seebeyondwhereyouare.com. All right? Great. Kathy Bond, thank you so much for being here. I really do appreciate it.

Cathy Bond

Absolutely.

Cathy Bond

Thank you, John, so very much.